07/09 11:46
00:00:00 Thanks, everybody.
00:00:01 Please be seated.
00:00:01 All right, folks, we're back on record in the – is it Kroenke?
00:00:10 Yeah.
00:00:11 All right.
00:00:11 I got it right this time.
00:00:13 Kroenke and Treasure Chest Matter, 3 a.m., 20-0862Civil Parties and Counselor, present.
00:00:19 Jury's absent.
00:00:20 You all have had a chance to look through the list.
00:00:22 Anybody who jumps out for cause?
00:00:25 Your Honor, once again, we agree there are no challenges for cause.
00:00:27 Okay.
00:00:29 All right.
00:00:29 I saw a couple of people who might have issues, but I think they deserve some questioning.
00:00:35 Exactly what we thought.
00:00:37 All right.
00:00:38 Madam Clerk, do you want to get the panel?
00:01:03 It's easy to get lulled into the... Good luck with this one.
00:01:40 I have no idea where the ethnicity of that comes from.
00:01:47 Not European continent.
00:01:51 That's Czech or Slovak.
00:01:54 Arabic?
00:01:55 Armenian?
00:02:04 yeah
00:02:32 Now we're missing a chair.
00:02:34 Is that on purpose?
00:02:40 10, 14, 17 spots.
00:02:43 We have 19 chairs.
00:02:45 Carolyn, can you do me a favor?
00:02:49 I'm counting chairs and I think we're going to be one short.
00:02:52 Could you go?
00:02:54 Yeah, but that's still only 18 and we've got 19 on the panel, so.
00:03:06 Seth kroenke v Treasure chest LLC
00:03:27 Seth Kroenke v Treasure chest LLC
00:03:59 One there and one in the back.
00:04:24 Seth Kroenke v Treasure Chest LLC
00:04:57 optical illusion perfect and in case anybody was wondering this is Carolyn one of our law clerks
00:05:29 Thanks for the help
00:06:07 It's a little nervousness saying it publicly.
00:06:12 Maybe they build up to it and they get one shot.
00:06:15 If it doesn't come up, they miss it.
00:06:36 I was asked that at the end just to make sure.
00:07:48 But I do always stipulate to ID now.
00:07:52 Can you identify the defendant?
00:07:53 Absolutely.
00:07:53 Exactly.
00:07:54 You stipulate that this is John Smith.
00:07:58 That was the man, right?
00:08:00 I see you've seen the debacle.
00:08:05 Avoid that debacle.
00:08:21 Seth kroenke
00:08:59 Thank you.
00:08:59 Thank you.
00:09:26 Yeah.
00:10:20 Good morning, everybody.
00:10:22 Still morning.
00:10:53 The last four of you, there's chairs down in front over here, so I promise we won't pick on you.
00:11:03 Thanks, everybody.
00:11:04 Please find a seat.
00:11:05 Have a seat.
00:11:05 Thank you.
00:11:11 All right.
00:11:12 Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.
00:11:13 Thank you for your patience in this process.
00:11:15 Welcome to Superior Court.
00:11:17 You have all been summoned as prospective jurors in a case
00:11:21 It's case number 3AN20-08622CIVIL.
00:11:30 This is a civil case.
00:11:31 It is not a criminal case.
00:11:33 My name is Tom Mathews, and I'm the assigned judge on this case.
00:11:37 Today we're going to be selecting a jury for this trial.
00:11:40 But before we begin, I want to thank you in advance for your service.
00:11:44 Our judicial system truly could not function without you, and we appreciate you being here to perform this civic duty.
00:11:50 If you were selected today, I believe you will find it to be a positive experience.
00:11:54 We're going to begin by having the attorneys introduce themselves and their clients, beginning with Mr. Brzezinski.
00:12:00 MR. Good morning, everyone.
00:12:01 My name is Martin Brzezinski, and along with Mike Bettinger, we represent Seth Kroenke.
00:12:06 MR. And Mr. Campion.
00:12:08 MR. My name is Clayton Campion.
00:12:10 I'm here to represent Mr. Randy Elliott and his company Treasure Chest LLC.
00:12:13 MR. All right.
00:12:15 Thank you.
00:12:15 So, ladies and gentlemen, in a moment, we're going to begin selecting the trial jury in this case.
00:12:20 This is an important stage in a trial because it is important for both sides to have a fair and impartial trial jury.
00:12:27 In this case, we are selecting 12 jurors and two alternates.
00:12:31 The parties are entitled to jurors who can approach this case with open minds and agree to keep open minds until reaching a verdict.
00:12:38 You, the jurors, must be as free as possible from bias, prejudice, or sympathy and must not be influenced by preconceived ideas, either as to the facts or the law.
00:12:50 Therefore, the attorneys for the plaintiff and the defendant will have an opportunity to ask you some questions.
00:12:56 These questions are not designed to pry into your personal affairs, but are to discover if you have knowledge or preconceived ideas regarding this case.
00:13:05 There may be times, however, when the questioning may touch on an area that you would rather not discuss in front of a room full of people.
00:13:11 If that happens, just let me know and we can handle these questions in private.
00:13:16 So if you feel uncomfortable about answering any question in public, just please tell me.
00:13:20 We'll take a break at an appropriate time to conduct questioning in private.
00:13:25 At times I may also decide that some questions should be answered separately.
00:13:29 It is extremely important that you answer all questions honestly.
00:13:33 I now want to tell you a little bit about what this case is about.
00:13:37 This dispute involves a contract dispute relating to gold mining.
00:13:42 Seth kroenke and randy elliott first met each other in april of two thousand and twenty mr elliott and his company treasure chest LLC owned mining claims in the dan creek area near mccarthy mr kroenke was a contractor based out of palmer and he was interested in either investing or purchasing a mining opportunity in the area so they entered into two agreements in the summer of two thousand and twenty to explore the possibilities
00:14:07 These two agreements form the heart of the dispute in this case and you will hear evidence about them.
00:14:12 You will also hear evidence about how they went about performing their obligations under the agreements and also about the disagreements that ensued.
00:14:21 There are many differences between the parties as you will hear if you are selected to hear this case.
00:14:26 Ultimately, the jury's role is to decide what the facts are and I will tell you much more about that later.
00:14:33 Let me tell you a little bit about our trial days.
00:14:35 The case is scheduled to last for five or six days, going to early next week.
00:14:40 Trial days are not full days, they are only partial days.
00:14:42 Our trial day will typically begin at 8.30 in the morning and end at 1.30 Monday through Thursday.
00:14:49 On Fridays, the trial day begins at 8.30 and ends at 12 noon.
00:14:53 There may be times when I have to address a different matter or I have issues to address with the lawyers before we can take evidence for the day.
00:15:00 So that you can plan, I will try to let you know before you leave each day what time you should return for the next day's proceedings.
00:15:07 However, once you retire to deliberate, you'll be required to deliberate all day until a verdict is reached.
00:15:14 We take breaks during the trial day, usually about every hour and a half or so.
00:15:17 We will not take a lunch hour, but you're welcome to bring food or snacks with you to eat while you're in the jury room.
00:15:24 You're always welcome to bring coffee, water, or soda into the courtroom.
00:15:28 and to drink them here.
00:15:29 I simply ask that you leave food in the jury room.
00:15:32 During your deliberations, the court system will provide lunch for jurors.
00:15:37 I realize that jury service requires each member of the jury panel to make personal sacrifices.
00:15:44 You will be away from your homes, family, or place of work during the day, so in a moment I'm going to ask whether or not you have an emergency or personal hardship or problem in your life that would prohibit you from serving on this jury.
00:15:56 I bring this up to give you time to think about it.
00:15:59 Please be aware that I'm using the words emergency and personal hardship deliberately and carefully.
00:16:05 I'm not talking about inconvenience because all jury members will experience some inconvenience.
00:16:10 If you are selected for questioning and want to discuss a personal emergency or hardship, please let me know.
00:16:17 So with that said, is there anybody who has an emergency that requires immediate attention right now?
00:16:25 seeing no hands go up all right because your answers to the questioning needs to be as honest as possible I now need to administer an oath to each of you if you would please stand and raise your right hand do each of you solemnly swear or affirm that you will truthfully answer all questions you are asked about your qualifications to serve as jurors in the case now before this court I see everybody nodding and saying yes thank you please be seated
00:16:56 Our state law also requires certain qualifications in order to determine whether you are eligible to be a juror.
00:17:02 So I'm going to ask you a series of questions.
00:17:05 Please raise your hand if your answer is yes to any of the following questions.
00:17:10 Number one, is there anyone who is not a citizen of the United States?
00:17:16 Number two, is there anyone who is not a resident of the state of Alaska?
00:17:21 Number three, is there anyone who is under 18 years of age?
00:17:27 Number four, is there anyone on the panel who is not of sound mind at this time?
00:17:34 Number five, is there anyone who is not in possession of his or her natural faculties?
00:17:39 That includes anything that would affect your ability to understand what is happening in court and to communicate with your fellow jurors.
00:17:48 Number six, is there anyone who cannot read or speak the English language?
00:17:54 Number seven, is there anyone who has been convicted of a felony and who has not been unconditionally discharged from probation and parole?
00:18:03 And number eight, is there anyone who has served as a juror in Alaska within the last year?
00:18:10 All right, I saw no hands go up and so thank you.
00:18:12 You are all qualified to serve as jurors in this matter and I thank you for that.
00:18:18 The lawyers will now have an opportunity to ask you some questions.
00:18:21 Please remember there is no right or wrong answer to these questions and the questions asked by the attorneys.
00:18:27 There are only truthful answers.
00:18:29 All of us may have strong feelings about certain things and it is important that you answer the questions as openly as possible.
00:18:37 Again, if there are matters that you would rather discuss in private, please tell me.
00:18:42 We're now going to begin with the plaintiff's side, Mr. Brzezinski.
00:18:45 Thank you.
00:18:49 Good morning ladies and gentlemen.
00:18:52 I'm Martin Brzezinski and along with Mike Benger we represent Seth Kroenke.
00:18:58 It's not important for you to get my name right, it is important for me to get your names right.
00:19:02 So if I mispronounce your name, please help me and correct me until I get it right.
00:19:06 That's important.
00:19:08 This is the only chance that we're going to have to speak with each other.
00:19:13 If you're selected to be a member of the jury,
00:19:16 You'll sit, you'll be listening to evidence coming from that seat, you'll see exhibits appear on that screen but will not have the ability to communicate.
00:19:26 So what I'd like to do is I'd like to speak with all of you individually and collectively and get an idea of what your ideas are, opinions and thoughts.
00:19:33 There are absolutely no right or wrong answers and I can't stress that enough.
00:19:39 Don't feel that this is an exam, this is school and you can say something that
00:19:44 won't be right.
00:19:45 There's absolutely nothing that is either correct or incorrect.
00:19:49 This is merely about your opinions and your ideas, and ideas are never wrong.
00:19:55 So some attorneys go down the rows and ask people individually.
00:19:59 I think the way I'd like to do it is I may ask questions of a person individually, but if you have something that you'd like to share, please speak up.
00:20:10 I'd like to speak to all of you as a general panel and hopefully you'll speak back to me and we'll have a dialogue that gets us where we need to be and quickly.
00:20:20 You don't need to raise your hands.
00:20:21 You're not going to be graded so this isn't going to be very stressful.
00:20:29 Now, the judge has already addressed many issues with you but I also like to touch base and make sure that no one has a
00:20:38 So if you're uncomfortable, you have a medical condition, you're taking a medication that's making you foggy, you're suffering from anything which will
00:21:08 Take away your attention from this case.
00:21:10 This is a great time to let us know and we'll address it either as a group or if it's something that you'd like to address in private, we can certainly do that at the bench.
00:21:20 Does anyone have anything going on in their lives that's going to be a problem for about a week?
00:21:30 Sir, you are Mr. Kelvin.
00:21:33 Yes, sir.
00:21:33 Okay.
00:21:36 So right behind the gentleman in front is Mr. Doggett.
00:21:42 There is a microphone there on a stand.
00:21:44 If you could hand that over.
00:21:46 There we go.
00:21:47 And come on up.
00:21:58 I'm trying to get my house packed.
00:22:00 My wife's adopting at home.
00:22:04 I'm trying to deal with this.
00:22:07 It's just kind of difficult to do it right now.
00:22:17 I did see in your questionnaire that you were scheduled to be leaving.
00:22:25 I wasn't quite sure on the timing of it, so you're supposed to be out of here in less than two weeks?
00:22:43 gentlemen any questions that you'd like to ask why don't you take a seat let me talk to the lawyer just briefly thank you Mr. Kelvin thank you for raising your hand we're gonna go ahead and dismiss you from this jury thank you and good luck to you sir you can go ahead and leave now thank you
00:23:23 If you are able to stand up and stretch, would that alleviate the condition?
00:23:31 The court will run from 830 to 130 approximately.
00:23:35 You may be here a few minutes earlier.
00:23:38 You get breaks.
00:23:41 okay so if you're a if you have a comfortable seat and then obviously you can stand up and stretch would you be okay obviously don't want to cause you more pain or more suffering okay and Ms.
00:23:54 Wertz no I'm sorry Ms.
00:23:56 Gates sorry and how are you employed ma'am
00:24:13 What do you do, ma'am?
00:24:14 Oh, I'm a therapist.
00:24:15 You're a therapist.
00:24:16 And you're leaving for Maryland on Monday?
00:24:18 Yeah.
00:24:20 Okay.
00:24:24 On this Sunday?
00:24:25 Yeah.
00:24:28 Okay.
00:24:28 Mr. Campion?
00:24:31 Any problem?
00:24:32 No.
00:24:33 All right.
00:24:34 Ms.
00:24:35 Gates, thank you.
00:24:35 We appreciate you raising that issue.
00:24:36 We'll go ahead and let you go.
00:24:38 Thank you.
00:24:39 Thank you, Ms.
00:24:39 Gates.
00:24:40 Anyone else?
00:24:41 Mr. Cole sir does that pain medication affect your ability to hear see detracts from your ability to listen I know some pain medication does are you currently taking that medication
00:25:09 Do you expect to be taking that for the next, let's say, weeks, eight days?
00:25:13 Three days, four times a day.
00:25:15 But you haven't taken any today?
00:25:18 For this reason right here.
00:25:19 For this reason, okay.
00:25:20 And is that causing you additional pain since you're not taking your pain medication?
00:25:27 Mr. Koehl, thank you for your candor, sir.
00:25:30 Under the circumstances, we're going to go ahead and let you go.
00:25:33 Thank you, sir.
00:25:38 Back to the entire panel.
00:25:40 Anyone else suffering from any condition which will make you uncomfortable, put you in pain, put you in a position that otherwise you wouldn't be in?
00:25:53 Is there anyone taking any medication that would hinder your ability to listen, comprehend, sort of get foggy or fuzzy in the head?
00:26:02 No one?
00:26:05 That would be Mr.
00:26:07 Are you in any discomfort right now sir?
00:26:11 Are you having a hard time focusing on?
00:26:13 Thank you
00:26:29 Is there anything, so outside of physical and health conditions, is there anyone who has something going on at home in your personal or professional lives that's going to detract from your attention?
00:26:44 We've had people who have child care problems, people who have, who are taking care of elderly parents and will not be able to do that.
00:26:52 Is there anything amongst your lives that will draw your attention, pull you away from this courtroom?
00:26:59 Yes, sir.
00:27:00 Mr. Liverman.
00:27:02 Yes, sir Are you his sole provider?
00:27:08 So there's no one else to take care of him?
00:27:27 And is he able and please excuse me if I'm not phrasing this correctly Is he able to function on his own go about his days or?
00:27:35 For example today who's taking care of your grandson today, sir So he's at home full-time
00:27:55 Have you left him alone in the past?
00:28:06 But during the day you're always at home?
00:28:09 So you work night, sir?
00:28:13 And what would happen if your grandson had a condition and you weren't around?
00:28:22 He told my house completely up two years ago.
00:28:26 And so what I do, he does have a mother here.
00:28:36 So I generally, if I can sense he's, you know, I can kind of like tell when things are not going right.
00:28:46 So if we took you away for a week or so, what would happen to your grandson?
00:28:49 Mr. Liverman, thank you.
00:28:51 I think given the circumstances
00:29:15 And also the fact that you're working nights, I would be a bit concerned about the situation for you.
00:29:22 So we're going to go ahead and let you go.
00:29:24 Thank you again for your candor.
00:29:29 And before we move on to something else, anyone else?
00:29:33 No one has any escaping goats that rampage the neighborhood, which we learned about this morning?
00:29:38 Okay.
00:29:43 Who watches lawyer shows?
00:29:47 Ah, man.
00:29:48 Why?
00:29:50 Entertainment.
00:29:53 Sir?
00:29:54 Same.
00:29:55 Mr. Euler?
00:29:55 Euler.
00:29:56 Euler.
00:29:56 Yes, sir.
00:29:58 Interesting.
00:29:59 Okay.
00:30:01 And Ms.
00:30:01 Wirth?
00:30:04 Okay.
00:30:05 Will you be sadly disappointed if we're not that entertaining?
00:30:09 Will you hold that against us?
00:30:11 Or our client?
00:30:13 Okay.
00:30:14 We'll try our best.
00:30:21 Who has served on a civil jury before?
00:30:26 Ms.
00:30:27 Bruner.
00:30:27 Not in Anchorage.
00:30:30 Okay.
00:30:30 And you are on a civil case or criminal case?
00:30:32 Just want to make sure.
00:30:33 I've done both.
00:30:34 You've done both.
00:30:35 How many times?
00:30:37 I think three trials and grand jury.
00:30:40 Okay.
00:30:41 And is there anything about those experiences which would affect you being on a jury now?
00:30:46 I don't imagine so.
00:30:48 Were you able to reach a verdict each time?
00:30:52 Were you the first person by any chance?
00:30:54 Okay.
00:30:55 And how many were criminal?
00:30:56 How many were civil?
00:30:57 Two were criminal, I think.
00:31:03 Maybe not a civil one.
00:31:09 Okay.
00:31:11 All right.
00:31:12 Anybody else has served on a jury?
00:31:17 Grand jury.
00:31:18 Grand jury.
00:31:18 Grand jury.
00:31:19 Grand jury as well?
00:31:20 No, just .
00:31:22 Ms.
00:31:22 Neres?
00:31:23 Neres.
00:31:23 Neres.
00:31:24 Neres.
00:31:24 Neres.
00:31:24 Got it.
00:31:26 Criminal or civil case?
00:31:27 Criminal.
00:31:28 Okay.
00:31:29 And same questions.
00:31:30 Were you able to reach a verdict?
00:31:31 Yes.
00:31:33 And were you the first person?
00:31:34 No.
00:31:35 And this was here in Anchorage?
00:31:36 It was in Anchorage.
00:31:37 There it is.
00:31:38 And anything about that experience, which would make you hesitant to repeat it.
00:31:42 Okay.
00:31:44 So in criminal cases, there's a very different standard.
00:31:47 In criminal cases, we have beyond and to the exclusion of all reasonable doubt.
00:31:51 It's the highest standard we have in law.
00:31:54 What percentage that is, attorneys have debated that for centuries.
00:31:59 It's 99 or 99.9.
00:32:01 We don't know.
00:32:01 It is basically, if you do not have a reasonable doubt, there you
00:32:08 It's the exclusion of all reasonable doubt.
00:32:10 One inkling doubt that you can't let go is enough for the government not to meet its burden.
00:32:18 In civil, which we're here, this is a civil case, the burden is very different.
00:32:24 It's preponderance of the evidence.
00:32:26 So we have the old scales of justice that we see on statues and in drawings.
00:32:30 And in order for the plaintiff, us, to meet our burden, we have to tilt those scales ever so slightly.
00:32:37 So is it 51%?
00:32:39 I like to think of it as 50% plus a piece of dust landing on it or a mosquito.
00:32:43 We just have to move the scales slightly.
00:32:48 Is everybody comfortable with that statement?
00:32:49 Some people are.
00:32:50 Some people think that everything should be beyond and to the exclusion of all reasonable doubt.
00:32:56 Anyone have an issue with that?
00:32:59 Is there anyone amongst you who for religious or personal beliefs can't sit in the judgment of others?
00:33:09 I know there's some faith which will prevent you from pointing your finger at somebody else or making a decision that can affect somebody else's life.
00:33:17 Anyone?
00:33:17 No?
00:33:17 Fantastic.
00:33:27 Let's talk about business records.
00:33:29 Anyone's job involves managing business records.
00:33:35 Listeners.
00:33:42 We manage medical records, so protecting the security of those and ensuring privacy.
00:33:51 Okay.
00:33:52 And I saw, I believe, Ms.
00:33:53 Wirtz.
00:33:56 I'm sorry, I'm having a hard time hearing you.
00:33:58 I work for accounting, so I do bookkeeping, so they have .
00:34:05 So you are, for lack of better, you're a bookkeeper?
00:34:08 Yeah.
00:34:08 Okay.
00:34:10 Anyone else?
00:34:12 Ms.
00:34:14 Collins.
00:34:15 Collins, yes.
00:34:16 I work for CPAs, but I'm the administrative person.
00:34:20 I'm not an accountant.
00:34:21 So, I mean, I see business records.
00:34:24 But you don't have to sit there and fiddle with the abacus and make this work.
00:34:27 Okay.
00:34:28 Who else?
00:34:28 Mr. Euler.
00:34:31 I'm a contract specialist, so I actually write contracts and payroll, you know, review payroll, invoices.
00:34:40 Who do you work for, sir?
00:34:42 Bureau of Land Management.
00:34:43 Okay.
00:34:43 So, this is interesting.
00:34:46 You write contracts.
00:34:48 And for whom do you write these contracts?
00:34:50 I mean, I know for your boss, for your employer.
00:34:52 For the federal government.
00:34:53 You're sorry?
00:34:54 For the federal government.
00:34:55 And who's the recipient of these contracts?
00:34:57 Who's on the other side?
00:34:59 various vendors businesses and these are businesses that do business with the Bureau of land management correct okay and aside from writing these contracts do you are you involved in accounting bookkeeping making sure those contracts are performed upon or you're just the person who puts this together how do you do that
00:35:29 quality control various spot inspections site visits going over payrolls so obviously sounds like an extremely detail oriented job okay anyone else mr. jerks Dirk is I'm sorry I'll get it
00:35:58 Before we leave, Mr. Jurgis.
00:36:00 And tell us about yours.
00:36:02 What is it you do, sir?
00:36:04 I work for H&R Block.
00:36:09 That's been my career.
00:36:11 But not with H&R Block.
00:36:13 And I think, Ms.
00:36:14 Berry, you had your hand up and you're hiding behind Mr. Doggett, who's kind of tall and he blocks you out.
00:36:23 I notarize commercial fishing permits in the notary.
00:36:26 Okay.
00:36:27 Excellent.
00:36:30 Did I miss anyone?
00:36:31 Because I missed your dog.
00:36:36 Is anyone in the course of their jobs responsible for getting reimbursed for expenses?
00:36:45 Sure.
00:36:46 That absolutely counts.
00:36:47 And you travel?
00:36:50 For business.
00:36:51 And then you'd like to be reimbursed by your employer for those costs.
00:36:56 What is that you don't do to document?
00:36:57 Is your employer picky about that So it's not just as you've come back from a trip and say had a great week $10,000 That doesn't that doesn't fly
00:37:26 Is anybody in a business where you can just say, hey, it's $10,000 for the weekend and somebody writes you a check?
00:37:31 No one?
00:37:32 Ms.
00:37:32 Fetko, you're smiling, so you must have an employer that I could work for.
00:37:36 Not me.
00:37:38 Not you?
00:37:39 Anyone?
00:37:42 Oh, you were just scratching your nose.
00:37:44 I almost caught you there, Ms.
00:37:46 Patterson.
00:37:46 I was hoping that you could share with us an employer who has that level of accounting.
00:37:51 Get in your job.
00:37:56 Expert witnesses.
00:37:58 If you're selecting this group, you're going to hear from one or more expert witnesses.
00:38:04 Now, does anyone think that experts are fake?
00:38:11 That we don't need experts in this world?
00:38:16 So an expert is somebody who has knowledge, training, and experience in a specific industry,
00:38:22 And they're asked to come to court, hired by an attorney or his client, to come to court and help the jury understand something that's complicated or offer their learned opinion about a subject.
00:38:37 Does anybody have an issue with that?
00:38:39 Some people do.
00:38:41 Does anybody think that would be actually helpful if you were a juror?
00:38:46 I see Mr. Euler is sort of nodding his head.
00:38:48 Mr. Doggett.
00:38:50 You were nodding your head, or you were just putting your... Experts are helpful.
00:38:54 Experts are helpful.
00:38:54 Why is that so?
00:38:57 I don't have knowledge in every possible field of experience, so having information from someone with experience in that field would be informative in making a decision.
00:39:07 Is there anyone who disagrees with Mr. Doggett?
00:39:09 It's perfectly okay.
00:39:10 I don't think he's going to take this personally.
00:39:13 Okay.
00:39:14 So, collectively you would find...
00:39:20 and expert opinion health.
00:39:23 A lot of heads moving.
00:39:25 Ms.
00:39:26 Berry, not Ms.
00:39:26 Berry, Ms., you have to help me with your last name, I don't want to butcher it.
00:39:30 Kewin.
00:39:31 Kewin.
00:39:32 Oh, that's easy.
00:39:33 Brzezinski's much harder.
00:39:35 Ms.
00:39:35 Kewin, how do you feel about that?
00:39:37 Would you find somebody sharing their thoughts with you on a subject that you may not be an expert on?
00:39:42 I agree.
00:39:44 So as the judge told you, this case is about mining and gold and contracts,
00:39:50 outside of Mr. Euler, we are not experts in those things.
00:39:54 But collectively, you are experts in common sense.
00:39:59 So we, you may not feel that you have specific knowledge to bring to the table, but we do count on you to apply your own common sense.
00:40:09 You've lived this long, you've lived successfully, all we're going to ask you to do is just apply the same standard to this case.
00:40:17 Now, do you have any pilots here?
00:40:18 Alaska's full of pilots.
00:40:20 Anyone fly a plane?
00:40:22 Nope.
00:40:23 Anyone has a spouse or significant other who is an aviator?
00:40:30 Ms.
00:40:30 Collins.
00:40:30 Not a spouse.
00:40:31 My son-in-law is a pilot.
00:40:33 Do you fly with him?
00:40:33 No.
00:40:34 She said that like, oh, no, absolutely not.
00:40:36 I'm not getting that little plane.
00:40:38 Why is that?
00:40:39 Well, he's never asked me for one thing, but I, no, it would just make me too nervous.
00:40:45 Is it because of your son or is it because of the plane?
00:40:47 No, because...
00:40:48 He flies small planes.
00:40:49 Okay.
00:40:50 You're okay with big planes?
00:40:51 I've flown in jets, yes.
00:40:54 Some people aren't.
00:40:56 I'm sorry?
00:40:56 Some people aren't.
00:40:57 I mean, doors fall off Boeing, so I can understand why somebody doesn't want to fly.
00:41:01 That's true.
00:41:02 So it's not your son-in-law that's the problem.
00:41:04 It's just a small confined space.
00:41:07 Anyone else have a friend who flies in small planes on occasion?
00:41:14 You're hiding them, Ms.
00:41:15 Berry?
00:41:15 Yes.
00:41:16 Please don't.
00:41:18 For work purposes, I fly in small planes frequently.
00:41:23 Three or four times a summer, five times a summer.
00:41:26 And where do you usually go?
00:41:28 Western Alaska, Ammonic, Bethel, Antioch.
00:41:32 Okay.
00:41:34 And do you charter planes?
00:41:37 Does the government provide that for you?
00:41:39 The government does.
00:41:41 How small of a plane do you go?
00:41:44 Four-seater?
00:41:44 Two-seater.
00:41:45 Do you enjoy it?
00:41:50 It's scary but fun.
00:41:53 Do you know the pilots who fly you around at this point?
00:41:55 Yes.
00:41:56 And you trust those pilots?
00:41:59 As much as I can, yes.
00:42:03 Why is that?
00:42:03 Is it just the flying or is it the pilots?
00:42:05 Yeah, but the scenery is beautiful.
00:42:08 Yes, we do have the greatest scenery in the world.
00:42:10 There is no doubt about that.
00:42:12 Anyone have any experience in gold mining?
00:42:18 Things that make Alaska good.
00:42:19 Fish, gold mining.
00:42:23 Anyone have a friend who's into gold mining?
00:42:26 Just like a field trip in elementary School.
00:42:31 Sure does today.
00:42:33 You had a pen and you mined for it.
00:42:35 You could be our expert at this point.
00:42:37 Did you enjoy the experience?
00:42:41 I was like eight.
00:42:43 It didn't cause you to become a lifelong miner, did it?
00:42:47 It wasn't a life-changing event.
00:42:49 Anyone else who has had any experience in mining or has friends, family members?
00:42:54 Mr. Dirkus.
00:42:56 Dirkus.
00:42:58 Dirkus.
00:42:59 Sorry.
00:43:00 Please go ahead.
00:43:01 Fair enough anyone else does anybody object to mining
00:43:28 It's not that the process of mining, but mining has an environmental impact, and there are people who feel it shouldn't happen.
00:43:37 Is there anyone amongst you who does?
00:43:39 And like I said, there's no right or wrong answer.
00:43:44 So if you're mining and you're following regulations, no one has a problem.
00:43:59 I know we've covered this probably to death at this point, but I do want to ask you one more question.
00:44:07 This case is extraordinarily important to us and our client's life.
00:44:14 This is one of the most important days in his life.
00:44:19 If you're selected to be on this jury for five, six, seven days,
00:44:23 Can you all assure me that you're going to give this case 100% of your attention?
00:44:29 There's nothing that's going to pull you away, not goats or children or family visits or panning for gold or anything that could potentially make your mind wander.
00:44:41 Everybody can do that?
00:44:42 Ms.
00:44:45 Jacques?
00:44:46 No, no, no.
00:44:47 How do you say it?
00:44:48 Jakes.
00:44:48 Jakes.
00:44:49 You said family visit.
00:44:50 My dad's from New Hampshire and he's a grandpa.
00:44:55 Is he here now or he's coming?
00:44:57 And how long is he planning on being here?
00:44:59 Until the 17th.
00:45:03 And how long has he been here?
00:45:10 So this will limit the amount of time that you have to spend with him.
00:45:16 How will that make you feel?
00:45:19 How often do you see your dad?
00:45:24 And may I ask how old your father is?
00:45:27 My dad is turning 70 this year.
00:45:29 And I have the older grandchildren in Alaska.
00:45:31 He's from New Hampshire.
00:45:35 What part of New Hampshire?
00:45:36 I'm from Claremont, New Hampshire.
00:45:40 Okay.
00:45:40 I went to college up in Bowdoin, so similar neighborhood.
00:45:45 Okay, well, we'll address that.
00:45:49 So all of you can assure me that
00:45:52 Some parts may be exciting, and we'll try to be entertaining.
00:45:55 Some parts may be dull, but you'll still give this case 100% of your undivided attention.
00:46:01 Thank you.
00:46:02 Thank you, Mr. Brzezinski.
00:46:04 Mr. Campion.
00:46:04 Thank you.
00:46:09 I'm going to do this a little differently.
00:46:11 I'm going to ask Mr. Uhler to take the microphone, and I'm going to call on each of you so that you all can expect to be asked some questions.
00:46:18 I'm not going to repeat things that Mr. Brzezinski covered.
00:46:21 How are you feeling about serving, Mr. Euler?
00:46:23 Okay.
00:46:24 Any initial reaction to what the judge read to you or the questions you've been asked by Mr. Brzezinski?
00:46:29 Not up here, no.
00:46:30 Okay.
00:46:31 I might ask all of you this, but I'd like to ask jurors on a scale of 1 to 10, 1 being the least excited, 10 being the most excited, how excited would you say you are to serve?
00:46:41 Five.
00:46:42 Okay, that's about right.
00:46:43 All right, and we heard a little discussion about your work
00:46:47 with the Bureau of land management.
00:46:49 Is your work primarily office-based or is it field-based?
00:46:53 Primarily office-based, I'd say about 10% is field-based.
00:46:56 And where do you have to go to the field?
00:46:59 SleepMu, Inaga, Gomeat, various different places for site visits, whether it be for environmental surveys or whatever.
00:47:10 There's a number of things.
00:47:12 And you have been doing this work for how long?
00:47:15 I've been doing this in Alaska.
00:47:18 for Bureau of land management for about nine years.
00:47:20 All right.
00:47:20 And that's what you said, how long you've lived in Alaska as well?
00:47:23 Correct.
00:47:23 Okay.
00:47:24 Is there anything that we haven't asked you yet or you haven't commented on that you think is important for us to know?
00:47:29 Not that I'm aware of.
00:47:30 Just the mission of Bureau of Land Management is overseeing land permits both for leasing.
00:47:39 I don't know how it does or if it does play into anything.
00:47:43 Sure.
00:47:43 I'm glad you raised that.
00:47:46 In your work,
00:47:47 Have you directly or indirectly been involved in overseeing mining operations on federal land?
00:47:53 Not directly overseeing it, but I have been directly involved with environmental work dealing with some of the mines, but nothing dealing directly with mining work itself.
00:48:08 Has that work created any strong feelings that you may have that are negative about the mining industry?
00:48:13 No, not if it's done in accordance with regulations.
00:48:18 Okay.
00:48:19 All right.
00:48:19 Please hand the microphone to your left to Ms.
00:48:20 Barry.
00:48:22 Good morning.
00:48:22 I can see you.
00:48:23 Hi.
00:48:24 How are you feeling about surveying?
00:48:26 Good.
00:48:26 Do you know each other at all?
00:48:27 No.
00:48:28 It's interesting.
00:48:28 You have folks that have interesting, sometimes similar professions.
00:48:33 So you work for Fish and Game?
00:48:34 Yes.
00:48:34 And is there a part of the state that you focus on or particular?
00:48:40 Western Alaska, Arctic, Yukon, Kuskokwin.
00:48:42 Okay.
00:48:42 So the McCarthy area in Wrangell-St.
00:48:44 Elias National Park, have you done work in that area at all?
00:48:48 That's where Dan Creek is, as the judge mentioned to you.
00:48:50 So Dan Creek is sort of eight miles, nine, 10 miles east of McCarthy, very remote though.
00:48:57 What do you think you're going to hear about Mr. Elliott's lifelong profession, lifelong passion in business has been gold mining in that area.
00:49:06 What do you think some of the challenges might be to gold mine in rural Alaska?
00:49:11 Oh my gosh, getting equipment out there, getting people out there, maintaining employees, communication.
00:49:17 Rural Alaska is hard to work in.
00:49:20 A lot of things to figure out.
00:49:23 So those are the challenges.
00:49:24 What do you think would make someone successful or able to do it for 40 plus years?
00:49:30 Great work ethic and just go get her attitude.
00:49:36 Okay.
00:49:36 I want to ask you briefly, your husband's a chemical engineer?
00:49:39 Yes.
00:49:40 Who does he work for?
00:49:41 Anvil.
00:49:42 Okay.
00:49:42 Anvil Doyon.
00:49:43 They just separated.
00:49:44 Sure.
00:49:46 Okay.
00:49:46 That's interesting.
00:49:47 Anything we've asked about so far that you think is relevant to our decision about whether you can serve on this jury?
00:49:51 No.
00:49:52 All right.
00:49:52 We're moving through this quickly.
00:49:53 Please hand the microphone to Ms.
00:49:54 Kuhn.
00:49:55 Did I get that right?
00:49:55 Yeah.
00:49:56 Thanks.
00:49:56 How are you feeling about serving?
00:49:57 Good.
00:49:58 Tell me about Charlie's Produce.
00:50:01 I'm a sales rep over there.
00:50:02 So you're going out to restaurants and institutions and selling produce?
00:50:06 I'm actually in office at the moment.
00:50:09 My accounts are in office ones.
00:50:11 I also will be going to Seward on the 19th.
00:50:14 I do cruise ships and schools.
00:50:17 So that would be my only thing.
00:50:21 And you've indicated you can serve here.
00:50:23 So what are your thoughts about what you've heard so far?
00:50:25 Um...
00:50:29 I feel like I didn't, I don't know.
00:50:32 I'm sorry, I didn't hear you.
00:50:33 You said you feel like you don't know what to expect?
00:50:35 No, I mean, it's not that I don't know.
00:50:36 I just would like to hear, I guess.
00:50:41 Yeah, you don't know what you're... Interesting.
00:50:43 Yeah.
00:50:43 What's going to happen, I guess.
00:50:44 What's going on?
00:50:46 So what happened here is Mr. Kroenke and Mr. Elliott
00:50:49 They had a deal, right?
00:50:50 They were going to do business together, and it fell apart.
00:50:52 In our legal system, sometimes it's slow, but our legal system exists so that we can resolve disputes and let you folks resolve it so that we don't resort to other forms of dispute resolution.
00:51:02 Do you have any concerns about helping resolve this dispute between these two guys?
00:51:06 No.
00:51:06 Okay.
00:51:07 Do you think that that's probably the best way to resolve disputes?
00:51:11 If it comes down to it, yes.
00:51:12 Yeah.
00:51:12 If you can't figure it out, yeah.
00:51:13 If you can't figure it out yourself.
00:51:15 Okay, thanks.
00:51:16 Please pass the microphone to your left, Ms.
00:51:17 Collins.
00:51:20 How are you feeling about serving?
00:51:22 I'm nervous.
00:51:23 What are you nervous about?
00:51:25 I don't know.
00:51:26 It's intimidating.
00:51:28 Is it intimidating?
00:51:29 No, no, no.
00:51:31 It's the whole thing.
00:51:32 We all have the same goal to make this easy.
00:51:34 Not easy.
00:51:35 It's hard.
00:51:35 Hard decisions need to be made.
00:51:36 But we want to make it easy for you to understand what the issues are, what the evidence is that supports our positions.
00:51:42 And then you work as a group, and that's the key, right?
00:51:44 You're not bearing the burden of this decision on your own.
00:51:47 You don't have to make the decision.
00:51:49 You have one of 12 votes, and then you get to decide.
00:51:52 And at the end, there's a verdict form that the judge will give you, and then you put your answers down there, and then one of you will be a foreperson, and then you sign it, and then that resolves the dispute.
00:52:01 That's the role that we're asking you to play.
00:52:03 You comfortable with that?
00:52:04 Yes.
00:52:05 Okay.
00:52:07 You hadn't ever served on a jury.
00:52:08 Maybe that's part of it.
00:52:09 You just haven't done it.
00:52:10 Once you do it, you'll be like, ah, you know, it's set up for people to be comfortable.
00:52:15 Swalling & Associates.
00:52:17 How long have you worked there?
00:52:20 Well, the founding partner of Swalling & Associates, I worked for him at a different firm, so it's been 30-plus years since we started together.
00:52:28 And one of the owners, Steve, right?
00:52:32 You worked for Steve?
00:52:34 You may be thinking of swelling construction.
00:52:35 Oh, I see.
00:52:36 Tell me about swelling and associates.
00:52:37 That's the CPAs.
00:52:39 I'm glad I clarified.
00:52:40 Okay.
00:52:41 You've been asked already about your role with working with CPAs.
00:52:46 I asked a little bit about the challenges of remote gold mining in rural Alaska.
00:52:51 What do you think the office support might look like for a remote gold miner like Mr. Elliott?
00:52:56 What do you think the office system or support might be?
00:52:58 I don't know.
00:52:59 I mean, I don't know whether they'd be local or be out there.
00:53:02 I don't know.
00:53:03 Okay.
00:53:05 If you learn that there is no office support, would that surprise you, if that's evidence that's presented?
00:53:10 None at all or none out in McCarthy?
00:53:13 Period.
00:53:14 Well, yeah, that would surprise me.
00:53:15 Why?
00:53:16 Well, it seems like someone has to keep track of how things are going or, you know, payroll and that kind of thing.
00:53:24 Sure.
00:53:25 Okay.
00:53:25 Well, I expect that you'll hear evidence about that.
00:53:27 Right.
00:53:27 Sure.
00:53:28 Sure.
00:53:29 Okay, anything that we haven't talked about yet that you think you should comment on?
00:53:32 All right, please hand the, can we still have the microphone?
00:53:35 Please hand it to your left, to Ms.
00:53:37 Neris.
00:53:38 And you're a pharmacist?
00:53:39 I am.
00:53:40 How long have you done that work?
00:53:42 Over 20 years.
00:53:42 Okay, but you've been in Alaska for 13?
00:53:44 Yes.
00:53:45 All right.
00:53:45 What brought you here?
00:53:46 I came at 18 to go to college at Fairbanks.
00:53:50 Oh, okay.
00:53:51 And you served on a jury about 25 years ago?
00:53:55 Yeah, I think so.
00:53:56 Okay.
00:53:56 How are you feeling about serving in this jury?
00:53:59 No concerns.
00:54:00 No concerns.
00:54:01 Okay.
00:54:01 Is there anything that's come up so far that you think we should know about?
00:54:04 I think on my sheet there, my husband works for an engineering firm and does some work up at Red Dog Mine.
00:54:11 Right.
00:54:12 So just as a disclosure for that.
00:54:14 Right.
00:54:15 And I've done a lot of work for Red Dog Mine as well.
00:54:18 Is he on site?
00:54:20 No, my daughter does have a summer internship up there, and so she's rotating on and off.
00:54:24 What is she doing?
00:54:25 Just biodiversity internship.
00:54:28 Okay.
00:54:29 Well, in the interest of time, I'll ask you to pass the microphone behind you to Ms.
00:54:32 Straw.
00:54:34 How are you, Ms.
00:54:34 Straw?
00:54:35 I'm good.
00:54:35 What are you thinking about this case so far?
00:54:40 I don't really have any information to go off of, so.
00:54:43 Does it seem like it might be interesting?
00:54:47 Yeah.
00:54:48 What do you think will be interesting?
00:54:53 What they have done, I'd like to hear what they've done already to try to resolve the issues they've had.
00:54:58 I think that is interesting to me.
00:55:01 If you don't hear about that, would that be okay?
00:55:04 Yeah.
00:55:05 Okay, if the judge says, you know what, that's sort of water under the bridge, it doesn't really matter.
00:55:09 What matters now is what the parties need to present.
00:55:12 You okay with that?
00:55:12 Yeah.
00:55:13 Okay.
00:55:14 You have five kids?
00:55:16 I do.
00:55:17 And who looks after them when you're here?
00:55:20 My husband is on summer break.
00:55:22 Oh, he's a principal.
00:55:23 Yeah.
00:55:23 Okay.
00:55:24 So you're not distracted at all by that.
00:55:26 Well, maybe you are.
00:55:27 Maybe he's not.
00:55:28 He's good.
00:55:29 Okay.
00:55:29 He does start work soon, so we have a week to play with, but not beyond that.
00:55:35 Well, we are going to hold ourselves to that week, I promise.
00:55:38 All right.
00:55:38 Is there anything we haven't asked you about that you think we should know about?
00:55:40 I don't think so.
00:55:43 All right, please hand the microphone to your right, to Ms.
00:55:45 Fetko.
00:55:47 How are you feeling?
00:55:48 Good.
00:55:48 Yeah, you feel like you can do this?
00:55:50 Yeah.
00:55:51 What do you think will be interesting about this?
00:55:54 I'm really interested to see what started the conflict, kind of the beginning era.
00:56:00 What are you anticipating?
00:56:02 I don't know what to expect.
00:56:03 Okay.
00:56:03 I'm really not sure.
00:56:05 So that there's maybe a mini drama within this whole trial that you're kind of anxious?
00:56:10 I feel like it has to have started on something.
00:56:13 sure do you watch gold rush shows or gold mining shows you have I don't know I figured you might why have you watched them or what have you found interesting about it just with my dad he's really into them but
00:56:27 I mean personally watching them I'm always like I feel like these guys lose money every year like why does anyone do this so what why do you say that what do you what do you think like they're always in trouble like gosh darn this just broke down yeah they have something to fix money to pay does it seem like it's sort of a high-risk business yeah is there anything we haven't asked you about that you think we should know about you or about your thoughts or anything
00:56:55 Okay, thanks.
00:56:56 Please hand the microphone to your right to Mr. Dezeu.
00:57:00 Dezeu.
00:57:00 Dezeu.
00:57:01 What nationality is that?
00:57:02 It's Dutch.
00:57:02 Dutch.
00:57:03 Okay.
00:57:03 Dezeu.
00:57:04 Neat.
00:57:05 You've been an electrical engineer as a career?
00:57:07 Yes.
00:57:08 And what kind of, I mean, specifically what have you done in that world?
00:57:11 Oil and gas and worked for a firm in Palmer.
00:57:16 That was a design-build firm.
00:57:18 Also some oil and gas.
00:57:20 A lot of business in communities all over in remote areas in Alaska.
00:57:26 And then just recently, more facilities engineering for ASRC Federal.
00:57:30 I see.
00:57:31 So you have familiarity with operating in remote Alaska, generally?
00:57:35 Yes.
00:57:35 Okay.
00:57:36 And would you agree with Ms.
00:57:37 Berry's comments about some of the challenges that rural Alaska poses?
00:57:41 Absolutely.
00:57:42 She didn't mention weather, though.
00:57:44 That's the biggie.
00:57:44 Weather.
00:57:45 Okay.
00:57:45 Yeah.
00:57:46 For flying or for anything, for sure.
00:57:49 What do you think it takes, based on what you've seen in your career, what does it take to be successful, to operate and, you know,
00:57:56 complete projects in rural Alaska?
00:57:58 Perseverance.
00:58:00 Okay, we heard that before.
00:58:00 That's interesting.
00:58:01 What do you think about planning?
00:58:04 Is that part of it?
00:58:05 Certainly, yes.
00:58:06 I mean, I imagine as an engineer, when you're planning a project, the success may depend on how effective your planning is.
00:58:13 Yeah, you don't want to forget that critical piece of equipment once you get out to a remote site, certainly.
00:58:19 Just off the top of your head, what's a remote project that you think of that was successful that you were involved in in your career?
00:58:28 There's been many.
00:58:32 For remote sites, the firm I was with, we did communications facilities on tops of mountain tops, and so I worked on one in Cordova, and that was one that was more hands-on for me, but definitely successful where I
00:58:57 got the power up to a state of Alaska comp site that had been down for years.
00:59:03 How long did the project take from beginning to end?
00:59:06 Probably, well it's hard to say because it was going on for a long time but when I took it over I worked on it for about six months.
00:59:13 And how much of that time was planning?
00:59:18 Most of it.
00:59:18 Most of the six months?
00:59:19 Yeah.
00:59:20 All right.
00:59:20 We have a limited amount of time.
00:59:22 Is there anything else that you think you should comment on that you've heard, thought about, observed up to this point?
00:59:26 Nothing.
00:59:27 All right.
00:59:27 I'm going to ask you to pass the microphone back to Ms.
00:59:29 Jakes.
00:59:33 Hi.
00:59:34 How are you feeling about serving?
00:59:35 Good.
00:59:36 Good.
00:59:36 Yeah, good.
00:59:36 All right.
00:59:37 That's good.
00:59:38 I'm not sensing that – so are you a homeowner?
00:59:41 I am.
00:59:42 How long have you owned a home?
00:59:43 I'm on my second home, and I've owned this current one for three years.
00:59:46 Three years.
00:59:47 Have you had technicians come to the house to work on things like plumbing, electricity, things like that?
00:59:52 Yeah, like a current French drain quote.
00:59:54 You got a current French drain quote?
00:59:55 Yep.
00:59:56 Okay, so you're living that right now.
00:59:57 Yep.
00:59:59 Have you received a bid or estimate?
01:00:00 Yeah.
01:00:01 More than one?
01:00:01 Yeah, of course.
01:00:03 Are you satisfied with the bids you've gotten?
01:00:05 I'm a minimum of like three to four, and we kind of go from there.
01:00:09 But yes, I'm satisfied with what I've received.
01:00:11 Okay.
01:00:11 Some super high, some super low.
01:00:14 When you agree, when you figure out which bid you're going to accept and move forward, are you expecting you'll sign some sort of a contract or sign the bid, or what do you expect?
01:00:22 Yeah, I'm expecting to understand the details of the bid, the amount of work that's required, and signing off on that, yeah.
01:00:29 You're pretty detail-oriented that way?
01:00:31 Yeah.
01:00:32 All right.
01:00:32 And that may not be everybody's life experience, would you agree?
01:00:36 True.
01:00:37 Yeah.
01:00:38 When you look at that contract, do you feel like you have the ability to push back and say,
01:00:42 I'm not comfortable with this term, and I'd like that to be changed, or I'd like that to be deleted.
01:00:46 Do you think you might take that approach with the contractor?
01:00:49 If I knew enough about the work, yes.
01:00:51 Okay.
01:00:52 But I would ask questions if I didn't understand, and if I wasn't sufficient with my answer, then I'd push back.
01:00:57 And when you sign the contract, do you think your rights will be protected when you sign it?
01:01:01 Why do you believe that?
01:01:03 That's the purpose of a contract.
01:01:04 Okay.
01:01:05 Purpose is to protect both parties' rights?
01:01:07 Protect both, yeah.
01:01:08 Yeah, okay.
01:01:09 Is there anything we have not asked about that you think is relevant
01:01:13 No, I just shared about the family business.
01:01:14 Yeah.
01:01:14 Okay.
01:01:15 We'll take that up.
01:01:15 Okay.
01:01:16 Thanks.
01:01:16 Please hand the microphone to Mr. Dirk Durgis.
01:01:21 Dirkus, not Durgis, right?
01:01:22 I got it?
01:01:23 Like circus with a D. Circus with a D. Oh, that helps.
01:01:26 All right.
01:01:28 So you work for H&R Block now.
01:01:30 And did I hear you say that your dad was involved in gold mining?
01:01:34 Played around with it.
01:01:35 Played around.
01:01:37 Would you call him
01:01:38 was it like a hobby or recreation for him or was it something that he made a living on it was just like to play with it I think like to see me get frozen like to see you get frozen yeah okay so you're standing in where in the river and you're freezing Yosemite National Basin out there well me River how much time did you spend doing that with your dad looking back probably not enough time I spent most of the time River he spent supervising okay
01:02:05 Did you recover much gold with him?
01:02:07 No.
01:02:08 Why do you think he wanted to do it?
01:02:10 Watch me freeze.
01:02:11 Fair enough.
01:02:13 What are you thinking right now about this case and serving as a juror?
01:02:17 Two people have a disagreement.
01:02:19 You okay helping resolve that?
01:02:21 This is what it takes.
01:02:24 Do you have any negative feelings about the legal system?
01:02:29 Sometimes I think it's too slow.
01:02:31 Too slow.
01:02:31 Well, here we are.
01:02:32 It's a 2020 dispute and it's 2024.
01:02:34 So yeah, is that going to distract you?
01:02:37 Or can you say, well, for whatever reason, whether it be COVID or whatever, here we are, we need to get this done.
01:02:42 It needs to be done.
01:02:43 Okay.
01:02:44 All right.
01:02:44 Please hand the microphone to your left.
01:02:46 Is it Ms.
01:02:47 Wertz?
01:02:47 I got that right.
01:02:48 How are you feeling about serving?
01:02:50 A little nervous.
01:02:51 What are you nervous about?
01:02:52 Oh, it's just the first time.
01:02:53 Okay.
01:02:54 Like we talked about with Ms.
01:02:57 Collins, you know, once you've done it, you see, well, it's not that impossible.
01:03:02 What kind of clients do you work with at your company?
01:03:05 Mainly it's a lot of it is like tenants so like yeah we own a lot of property that we rent out to other businesses so it's a lot of lease agreements and whatnot are you involved in developing no
01:03:22 I've looked them over and I try to uphold what's in the contracts for rent amounts and rent increases and all that, but I don't do anything.
01:03:37 Are these commercial or residential tenants?
01:03:40 Just depends, mostly I think residential.
01:03:44 Generally, how long are the lease agreements that your company uses?
01:03:46 Couple years, like five years.
01:03:48 I'm sorry, I should have been more clear.
01:03:50 How long in terms of how many pages?
01:03:52 um typically like up to 10 pages I would say okay what you're gonna all hear if you're sitting on this jury is Mr. Kroenke drafted a one-page agreement that outlined the terms of their mining operations for the 2020 season it's one page and so essentially the heart of this case is trying to figure out what does that agreement mean and whether either of these folks breached that agreement so it's all gonna be in one page okay all right so is there anything we haven't asked you about you think that's important for us to understand about you serving as a juror nope
01:04:22 Please hand the microphone to your left to Ms.
01:04:23 Patterson.
01:04:24 I don't think we've heard from you yet, have we?
01:04:26 No.
01:04:26 How are you feeling?
01:04:27 You're anxious to talk, right?
01:04:29 Okay, what are you thinking about?
01:04:30 I feel like it'll be interesting to just hear both sides and get to figuring out the contract and all that.
01:04:41 It feels like everybody's anxious to get this thing started.
01:04:42 If I'm going to serve, I'll start hearing the evidence.
01:04:44 Let's just stop talking, Clint.
01:04:45 Okay.
01:04:47 You mentioned at the end that there's something going on with your mom.
01:04:49 Do you feel like anything that's come up so far is going to touch on that at all?
01:04:52 No.
01:04:53 You feel like you can serve in this case?
01:04:54 Yes.
01:04:55 Okay.
01:04:55 What have I not asked you that I should have asked you about you serving as a juror?
01:04:59 I don't have anything.
01:05:00 Is there anything else you want to comment on?
01:05:01 No.
01:05:03 Okay.
01:05:04 Please hand the microphone down to Ms.
01:05:05 Bruner.
01:05:06 I got it.
01:05:07 She's not a 10.
01:05:08 I can tell.
01:05:09 She's like a 4.
01:05:10 What are you thinking?
01:05:15 I don't like public speaking.
01:05:16 Oh, sorry.
01:05:17 I won't go long.
01:05:18 You've been on a jury a bunch, though, so you kind of know what to expect.
01:05:21 Yeah.
01:05:22 And so for Ms.
01:05:23 Collins, Ms.
01:05:23 Patterson, Ms.
01:05:24 Wertz, who said, I'm a little anxious, what would you say to them?
01:05:30 Just use common sense and listen to all the evidence, and it's not hard.
01:05:34 It's not a test, right?
01:05:35 It's not like we're going to say, so tell us what you heard yesterday in that testimony, right?
01:05:41 When you served as a jury, do you remember...
01:05:44 Do you remember the judge instructing you on how to evaluate witness credibility?
01:05:49 What do you remember about that?
01:05:58 Witness credibility we were talking about.
01:05:59 What did you remember about that?
01:06:01 I mean, of all the instructions that the judge gave, there was, like you were saying, or
01:06:11 I'm not sure who said that, expert witnesses and stuff like that to give them maybe more weight.
01:06:17 Okay, well I predict, I think I'm right in predicting that the judge will instruct you on witness credibility and it'll help you with factors for you to evaluate whether or not witnesses are telling you the truth.
01:06:28 So you've done this before, you've heard witnesses testify and decided whether you believe them or not.
01:06:32 You're comfortable doing that?
01:06:33 Okay.
01:06:35 Is there anything we haven't asked you that we should know?
01:06:38 No, but I do want to
01:06:40 I just realized that I do know Seth.
01:06:44 I didn't know his last name.
01:06:45 My son actually works for him, Travis.
01:06:52 I met him twice in the last five or six years.
01:06:57 How long has your son worked for Seth?
01:07:00 I don't know, maybe five years.
01:07:01 You're totally on the spot now.
01:07:03 Does your son like working for Seth?
01:07:06 He doesn't really talk about work that much.
01:07:09 I mean, I think he's happier with Seth than he was before.
01:07:13 Okay.
01:07:13 What kind of work does he do for Seth?
01:07:16 What does he not do?
01:07:18 He is a welder.
01:07:20 He's a heavy equipment operator.
01:07:22 He's a jack of all trades, I think, I guess.
01:07:25 And your son's last name is?
01:07:27 Turnbull.
01:07:28 Okay.
01:07:29 I'm going to, at this point, I think it's time for you to, he's a witness, so we didn't address witnesses, so...
01:07:35 Oh, see, I didn't even know any of that.
01:07:36 Yeah, I'm glad we got there.
01:07:37 So I would ask for her to be excused since her son's a witness.
01:07:40 All right.
01:07:43 We'd love for her to stay.
01:07:45 Thank you.
01:07:46 Thanks for bringing that up.
01:07:46 Yeah, we got there.
01:07:48 We should have gone through the list of witnesses to begin with, and I apologize, folks.
01:07:53 Anyone else have a kid that works for Travis?
01:07:55 I mean, for Seth.
01:07:57 Is Britta, oh, sorry, wrong door.
01:07:59 Double doors.
01:08:00 Okay.
01:08:00 Mr. Doggett, we're almost done here.
01:08:02 What are you thinking so far about your potential service?
01:08:06 I'm saying nervous, never done it before, but... Do you feel like you have comfort in the way we're handling it so far?
01:08:13 Yeah.
01:08:14 Yeah, okay.
01:08:16 Has anything come up yet that you think you should comment on or that you haven't been asked about that you think is relevant to your service?
01:08:22 I don't think so.
01:08:23 Okay.
01:08:23 You work at South Central Foundation.
01:08:25 Yes.
01:08:26 Is there a particular location you work at or you work at the main...
01:08:29 I work at the Fireweed Behavioral health clinic.
01:08:31 Okay.
01:08:32 And who are the clients or patients that you deal with?
01:08:35 I work with anyone in the community experiencing a mental health concern.
01:08:39 Including children?
01:08:40 Yes.
01:08:40 Okay.
01:08:41 And it's all outpatient?
01:08:43 Yes.
01:08:43 So people come to see you, they'll have scheduled appointments?
01:08:46 Yeah.
01:08:46 All right.
01:08:47 And do they come from all over the state or are they primarily from Anchorage?
01:08:51 All over the country.
01:08:52 All over the country.
01:08:52 Okay.
01:08:53 And are they, in order to be eligible, do you have to be
01:08:59 A tribal member, do you have to be a Alaska native?
01:09:01 A consenting individual.
01:09:04 Okay, so anyone, you can see anyone.
01:09:05 All right.
01:09:09 Obviously, you have a lot of empathy, right?
01:09:10 I mean, that's part of what you have to have to be in the job.
01:09:14 How do you feel about sort of evaluating two people who are, I mean, frankly, they're not people that are in crisis.
01:09:21 They're strong-willed, stubborn guys that have a disagreement and they are bringing this case to you for you to resolve.
01:09:27 How do you feel about that?
01:09:29 That's the point, right?
01:09:30 Yeah, yeah.
01:09:30 And your skill set in terms of evaluating people and reading them, you think that'll be helpful to you in this process?
01:09:38 I don't know.
01:09:39 My running joke is I don't do it for free.
01:09:42 Was it 25 bucks a day?
01:09:46 I'm sure it's, yeah, I'm not going to sit here and be expert witness on whether or not somebody's telling the truth.
01:09:52 Right, but you feel like you've got the skill set to say, yeah, I feel like this person's being straight with me.
01:09:58 As much as anybody else.
01:09:59 Okay.
01:09:59 All right.
01:10:00 Anything that we haven't asked you about that I should know?
01:10:01 I don't think so.
01:10:03 Please hand the microphone.
01:10:04 Ms.
01:10:04 Castillo, how are you feeling about serving?
01:10:07 All right.
01:10:08 Nobody's talked to you yet, right?
01:10:09 No.
01:10:09 Okay.
01:10:09 Well, here you go.
01:10:10 This is your chance.
01:10:11 So you are a young person.
01:10:13 You work as a car rental clerk.
01:10:15 Yeah.
01:10:16 How long have you done that work?
01:10:18 Two and a half years.
01:10:19 Okay.
01:10:20 And what are you thinking about serving as a juror?
01:10:23 All right.
01:10:24 Yeah?
01:10:25 Not excited?
01:10:29 What have we talked about that has been interesting to you?
01:10:34 Nothing really.
01:10:35 Gold mining, aviation, contracts, receipts, what do you think?
01:10:39 It just sounds all right.
01:10:41 Okay.
01:10:41 Well, what I expect is that you're going to see a lot of documents, you're going to hear from witnesses, you might see some pictures and videos, and then you're going to get a bunch of instructions from the judge and then probably Mr. Brzezinski and I will make arguments to you and then it'll go to you for
01:10:54 Discussion, deliberation, and a decision.
01:10:56 Are you comfortable with that?
01:10:58 Yeah.
01:10:58 All right.
01:10:59 Those are my questions.
01:10:59 You can set the microphone down.
01:11:01 Thank you.
01:11:01 Thank you, Mr. Kroenke.
01:11:02 All right, folks.
01:11:04 So lawyers have had a chance to ask me some questions.
01:11:08 The next phase of this is we're going to go through – I'm going to go through with the lawyers what you have said.
01:11:15 Some of you are going to be excused.
01:11:16 Some of them are going to get in the state.
01:11:18 We'll try to do that process quickly, but we're going to give you about a 15-minute break.
01:11:24 So please stay on the floor but use the restroom and we'll try to have you out of here by 1.30, okay?
01:11:30 All right, thanks everybody.
01:11:59 Thank you.
01:11:59 Jury is out.
01:12:00 We're still on record.
01:12:02 Any cause challenges?
01:12:03 Mr. Campion.
01:12:04 No, Your Honor.
01:12:26 Mr. Brzezinski?
01:12:29 Judge, I wouldn't be opposed to Ms.
01:12:32 Jake's juror 11.
01:12:35 I think we're going to have plenty of people to get a – to get a seat of jury.
01:12:39 I have no objection.
01:12:41 That's fine.
01:12:41 If the court wants to let her go, I – She was actually my question mark when I went through it, given the circumstances.
01:12:49 Since I think we have plenty of jurors, I'll go ahead and excuse her for calling as well.
01:12:54 Thank you for raising that.
01:12:55 Anybody else, Mr. Brzezinski?
01:12:56 No, sir.
01:12:57 All right.
01:12:58 So, peremptory challenges.
01:12:59 We'll give you back your lists and give you about ten minutes or so.
01:13:07 And then, obviously, we're going to have more, I think, than we need, so I'll go through randomly when we get done and see what we've got left.